Afterparty
Annihilator-X17 I'd like to extend a special thanks to all who came here today to speak, and to Bioware for making this possible, by building the game and then by flying us all out there to see it. And with that, you are all free to talk.
Tenjac yep
Onyx1 ah, i was interested if you could remove the armor from the zombies and skeletons (as they're always shown wearing it)..
Tenjac nope
Tenjac it's part of their appearance
Adinos Well, I just wanted to say thanks for hosting this.....it was useful, even though not all questions got answered.... we know more about some things than before, at least.
Osagasu D:
Onyx1 oh, so you can't modify them even a little?
Tenjac well, the chat log is going to have more answers than the chat
TigerDragon right
Osagasu I see how it is
Osagasu They want you to go to that site
TigerDragon some of the questions couldn't be answered and some were answered, but we ran short on time
Osagasu 10 till closing, I need to shut down
Osagasu See yall
TigerDragon so they didn't get repasted
Tenjac Haha... no, we just got so many questions and so many answers we can't cover them all
fluffyamoeba and Annihilator-X17 had a power cut in the middle
fluffyamoeba and as he was running the chat...
Annihilator-X17 yeah, that was annoying
Annihilator-X17 damn thunderstorms
BioCraig How'd it all turn out?
Tenjac if we tried to cover it all we would all still be here at 8:00
Onyx1 at least with the nwn2 toolset you can tint and scale monsters, in the da toolset you can't change monster appearance at all it seems, besides giving them weapons.
Tenjac went great Craig... thanks for all the help
Tenjac we didn't cover all the questions, but we're going to put all your responses in the logs
Annihilator-X17 we only just finished craig
Annihilator-X17 2 minutes before you arrived
Helekanalaith Sunjammer <3 ;)
BioCraig There are tints and variations available for some of the creatures
LdyShayna So the logs will lie about what participants actually saw? ;)
Onyx1 and for skeletons and zombies?
Tenjac right.. I just remembered working on the zombies and looking at putting new armor on them
fluffyamoeba there's not actually any zombies
Six Hopefully with the CC stuff, we'll be able to do a lot more than tint and scale with a little Max or paint-program-of-choice work :)
Adinos Any chance of a repeat session like this, .... say, in September?
fluffyamoeba we...repurposed something else
BioCraig It's just not possible to do the full tinting that NWN2 had without modifying art assets - which we aren't talking about yet.
Onyx1 well 2walking corpses" , same thing fluffy
fluffyamoeba :D they moved a bit quickly for zombies
Annihilator-X17 Adinos, we'll have another one at some point
Tenjac hahah yes
Tenjac that was something we wanted to look at but ran out of time
Tenjac I actually made 3 different types of zombies, as well as a basic weapon of every type
Onyx1 so all the zombie models come with a bucket on their head and those leather streps around their torso? :)
Annihilator-X17 lol
Tenjac turned out i should have been working on other things
Helekanalaith Lack of art asset talk puts a damper on predeveloping new content. :(
Annihilator-X17 yeah, well, that was a directive when we left Edmonton to not talk abut custom artwork
fluffyamoeba though tbh, we haven't really been told anything about the art stuff
Annihilator-X17 yeah, not much info there anyway
fluffyamoeba as for both events, the art people who got invited couldnt make it
Helekanalaith Probably making nudie stuff.
Adinos Well, we can plan.... of course, in my case, new content (models and textures in particular) are kind-of what I am most interested in, so I don't expect many answers for me for now
fluffyamoeba given the rating, that's probably in there somewhere already
Helekanalaith Jigglymesh?
Annihilator-X17 lol
Onyx1 do you believe they'll implement multiplayer and the possibility to make pw in a year or two?
fluffyamoeba no
fluffyamoeba as it's rewriting the engine :p
Onyx1 and that would take a lot of time?
Helekanalaith Still no multiplayer? Even after all those disgruntled posts? :O
fluffyamoeba well the original engine took 5 years...
Annihilator-X17 yeah, Dragon Age will likely be SP only, until a new game at least
fluffyamoeba yeah, 5 people on the interwebs want MP...
Annihilator-X17 lol
Six MP expansion pack?
Onyx1 5 years ago they still said it'll be a multiplayer game
fluffyamoeba and they hadnt written the engine then :p
Onyx1 "5 people".. yeah sure
LdyShayna Very unlikely an expansion pack would add it. Possibly a sequel or another game in the franchise.
LdyShayna If it is added
Onyx1 and that could come in a year or 2..
Adinos optimist!
Onyx1 i think that would be a smart move anyway..
Tenjac|AFK :P
Onyx1 wghile people are still very interested in the game
Tenjac|AFK and I think another event similar to this could certainly be possible :P
TigerDragon i'm one of those 5 people
TigerDragon >.>
Onyx1 me too.. i'm not very interested in custom modules but i somehow like pws from time to time.. rarely but still
Adinos if the social site re-opens before the game launch (as someone was saying), it might be a good idea to have another session at that time...once people have gotten a look at the wiki and such...
Six If the SP OC is playable, that I guess would balance the lack of MP a little
Six No comment on what I thought of the NWN OC :D
Onyx1 i think 5 people liked that
fluffyamoeba lol
Helekanalaith Maybe if we make more topics asking after multiplayer they'll quickly slap it together? ;p
Six Getting a game and toolset for the price of a game is a great deal MP or no MP?
Onyx1 fluffy, coul you say somrthimg about the customisation of placeables? so.. i heard you can change the material?
Six just as long as its not a crappy game
Onyx1 (mybe there'll be some custom conent genious that will implement mp?)
fluffyamoeba there's no point in asking me about art stuff, i really haven't touched it at all
* fluffyamoeba has no artistic talent at all
Onyx1 :)
Helekanalaith Singleplayer > Multiplayer. I have no time to deal with social drama online. (Not anymore at least :( )
Onyx1 so.. what is your talent then?
fluffyamoeba breaking things
fluffyamoeba er...scripting
Onyx1 the thing i'm least interested in :(
Andarian From what I saw, I don't think that an MP version is anywhere in the offing
XavierGrimwand Does anyone know if OpenOffice is sufficient for editing DAO's 2DA files?
BioCraig it is
Six [23:01] Helekanalaith Singleplayer > Multiplayer. I have no time to deal with social drama online. (Not anymore at least :( ) << Social or "Social, wink wink"
Andarian And I'm quite happy personally with it as an SP game -- that's all I mod or play
fluffyamoeba "social" site indeed
Lore Or to that matter Notepad?
Onyx1 but.. isn't it a bit weird that bioware decided to build an engine that perevents multiplayer?
fluffyamoeba notepad no as they are excel files
fluffyamoeba not really as only 10% of people who bought nwn ever played it mp
Helekanalaith Uhhh... the latter (@ Six)? ;)
Andarian Onyx: I don't think so, no. Why would it be?
Onyx1 i don't know about the exact percentage.. but thats still A LOT of players
fluffyamoeba and you have to compromise on some things to get mp
Six Whats all this with you and Strat then, Hel? :D
Onyx1 because many people are interested in the multiplayer aspect of games.. isn't it logical
Helekanalaith Dunno, he's playing hard to get... Didn't like something I filled him in on earlier. :p
Andarian I think it's a matter of identifying your target audience and trying to make the best possible game you can for that audience...
Onyx1 and the compromise argument.. i really don't bite into it
fluffyamoeba o really
fluffyamoeba so... DA loads 1 area into memory at once
fluffyamoeba nwn had to load all of them for mp
fluffyamoeba you only have a certain amount of memory you can use
fluffyamoeba so areas have to be smaller/less detailed/fewer instead
Adinos eh, doesn't it load one "area list" into memory ?
Andarian ...and they focused on those things that enhance and enable story-based single-player gaming (cutscenes, cinematics, and so on)
Helekanalaith Semantics, Adinos :)
fluffyamoeba yes, but i think the general idea is that there's a limit on that
fluffyamoeba so i mean - not the whole module
Adinos right
Andarian Trying to be "all things to all people" dilutes your focus, and can impose an architecture on you that doesn't do any specific thing very well, but several things moderately well
Adinos on the subject of size.....how big is the toolset (how many MB, that is) ?
fluffyamoeba hmm...not sure actually
Onyx disconndcted :/
fluffyamoeba as it presumably shares assets with the game itself and we dont have that
* Flaming_Sword hopes fluffyamoeba is still logging >_>
Helekanalaith For those in the know, how is its resource consumption compared to let's say... Visual Studio?
Andarian Gotta run -- later folks!
Helekanalaith Laters.
fluffyamoeba that depends - the toolset loads things as you need them
fluffyamoeba so if you never load an area, it uses far less memory than if you have 10 areas open and 20 creatures
Adinos are you allowed to talk about assets, like, how many different placeables there are and such? I am wondering how that compares to NWN (and NWN2)
Helekanalaith Hm. Makes sense. The creatures still have 3D previews then?
fluffyamoeba hel, yup
fluffyamoeba assets, i have no idea because we've not got all of them afaik
Lore Is there serious risk of crashes, if the user opens to many windows, or does the toolset recognize that and limit the number of open windows?
* Six would love if there was some way of texture swapping, either in toolset, dynamically, or even just via 2da
Six Like how cloaks work in NWN1
BioCraig @Adinos: There are a large number of placeable appearances - I don't have the toolset handy so I can't say an exact number
fluffyamoeba we've been getting more as more things have been shown in screenshots, but i dunno what proportion we have
Six Guess that's not really something that'll get answered
BioCraig but much higher than nwn1 at launch
Adinos OK, thanks...
Helekanalaith Even in regards to normal objects and creatures?
Helekanalaith Like say... wild life?
fluffyamoeba crashes: yes it crashes, but not that often. and because of the versioning system it's not really an issue
fluffyamoeba as in it's "oh i need to restart the toolset (and email a bug report)" not "aaaaargh it's corrupted 3 months' work"
Helekanalaith Aw, we don't get to learn from our mistakes then ;)
Lore A builder worth it's name would have backups at the very least, no ;)
BioCraig additional note on placeable appearances: though there are probably at as many as a couple hundred of these, they are a small subset of the number of props you can use in cutscenes and the level editor
Adinos those resources are really where my main interest is - I really look forward to being able to manipulate them in various ways in 3DS Max (or, in the case of textures) in Photoshop.
fluffyamoeba scott meadows, who does the toolset, challenged us to crash the toolset in such a way that it corrupted data... and i don't think we managed it yet
Lore I've got faith on you, you'll succeed. It's but a matter of time ;)
BioCraig Generally there are very few crashes with the toolset - I tend to run it with between 10 and 40 assets open at a time without troubles.
BioCraig Assets ranges everywhere between areas and levels down to creatures and scripts
Helekanalaith Any potential danger to using another's SQL statements?
fluffyamoeba well, yes :p
fluffyamoeba if someone writes an sql statement to delete the database...
fluffyamoeba ...then it'll delete the database :p
Helekanalaith No warnings on mass adjustments or the likes?
fluffyamoeba if you're editing the database directly, you are using mssql tools, not the toolset
* Helekanalaith wonders if the toolset will crash if all the data suddenly goes missing ;p
Helekanalaith Ah, there's no way to pass statements through scripts then?
fluffyamoeba while it's running - probably. will probably also crash if you delete its exe while it's running too
fluffyamoeba Helekanalaith, no - the database is a builder resource
fluffyamoeba actual modules (things with running scripts) are exported from the database and packaged
* Helekanalaith nods.
Lore I know nothing of SQL so do not kill me, but is there any risk of the community distributing virus, or even just mod corrupter toolset editing programs using SQL stuff?
fluffyamoeba not as such
Adinos but you could implement a virus-like disease in a mod.... ;-)
* Annihilator-X17 wanders back in
fluffyamoeba Adinos, not really because the mod is not distributed as an sql dump
fluffyamoeba :p
Flaming_Sword little bobby tables ;)
Helekanalaith Couldn't help but read "little booby tables"
Onyx do you know the base cooldowns for daggers /swords/ two handed swords perhaps?
Adinos no, I mean...something that would work just within one playable module.... infect all creatures you encounter
Annihilator-X17 Onyx, combat is still on a 9 second round, rom what i remmeber, so there isnt individual weapon cooldown
Onyx combat seems a bit too fast for my taste.. maybe because i'm used to d&d rpg games with slow swinging at the beginning
Annihilator-X17 at least, not that i remmeber
Annihilator-X17 not looked too deeply into that, though
Onyx hm, i thought every weapon hits in intervals.. dagger for example every 1.5 sec (with modifiers) swords every 2 sec. etc
Lore One last question, how much of the combat system is scripted, and how much hardcoded?
BioCraig @Onyx I don't know the exact cooldowns on the various weapon types, but they are all changeable in 2das
fluffyamoeba however, the animations woul dlook odd if you change the speed too much
BioCraig I'm not sure what this 9 second round stuff you are talking about it
Annihilator-X17 that was mentioned to us at the builder's event
Onyx i know they'rew changeblae i just wanted to know what can i expecr in the official campaign
Annihilator-X17 wb sunny
Sunjammer howdy
Helekanalaith Sunjammer <3
fluffyamoeba you have a fan!
Annihilator-X17 bit more than a fan ;p
Adinos Anyhow, this was interesting....but it's getting late here in Europe, and I have to be at work early tomorrow, so bye, everyone
Helekanalaith 0:)
fluffyamoeba byee
Sunjammer Tenjac might get jealous
Onyx bye bye
Helekanalaith I doubt Tenjac will hold the inside of your pocket as religiously as I would.
Sunjammer so how did things finish up after I left for food (which I've only just got and it's not chilli it's pasta)
BioCraig @Lore Almost all of the combat is script controlled - very very little is hardcoded.
Rane So turn-based combat is more than possible?
Annihilator-X17 problem in that instance is probably the gui, which is hardcoded.
Onyx if you script a turn i guess :)
Onyx ohh, yeah, that' a thing i hate.. no combat log :(
Lore That is nice, I'm sure the PRC team will not have to go through the process of creating a basically new combat system this time round ;)
fluffeeeamoeba well scriptwise, yup you could
Annihilator-X17 No, we're planning on just using the existing one, rather than recreating it ;p
BioCraig You can prompt pauses through script at the end of a round if you wanted to go to the trouble of scripting it.
Rane That's not really turns though.
Annihilator-X17 I haven't looked, is there a timestop effect?
Helekanalaith "Pause"
fluffyamoeba there's pausing
Annihilator-X17 yeah, but i mean one that pauses everything but the one its called on
fluffyamoeba as there's definitely references in script to the autopause config
Helekanalaith Can we prevent warrior and rogue players from using pause? :p
Onyx can you talk a bit more what affects attack speed, to hit chance?
Annihilator-X17 lol
BioCraig @Rane: it effectively could be by disabling your abilities when it wasn't your "turn" and pausing when it was- but that would require a fair amount of effort
Sunjammer BioWare: so guys we made you this rilly cool, pause and play, real time action crpg
Sunjammer Community: cool
Sunjammer Community: but can we change the setting to Eberron, change it to turn based and drop all the story elements?
Annihilator-X17 you forgot: And add multiplayer
Helekanalaith + Aribeth
Sunjammer with mounts and climbing
Lore and a DM client
Rane Change it?
Annihilator-X17 and DnD rules :P
Helekanalaith Climbing and mounting Aribeth? Sounds kinky.
Rane Hardly.
Lore and flying mounts
Rane Just creating something in addition to the campaign itself.
Onyx hm.. i don't get the point in ridiculing the wish to mod with the toolset to its limits..
Helekanalaith Let's not make it a D&D game... for you know what reasons. ;)
Sunjammer still at least like with NWN2 all those total makeovers will be out in 15 weeks (tm)
Onyx yes, we can go by the staple, but why should we?
Annihilator-X17 gahaha
Annihilator-X17 I remember those SJ :)
Sunjammer so we should be safe until 2012ish
Rane From Soon™ to 15 Weeks™?
Rane Cool
Lore Point is, no matter how moddable it is, people will want more. Next I'm sure we'll have, can I create an FPS?
Helekanalaith That'd be cool too. :o
Annihilator-X17 Hel, you like everything :)
Helekanalaith Just need crosshairs... darn, no GUI additions :(
Flaming_Sword "can i create nethack?" :P
Rane Visual effect?
Lore no GUI was a bit of a shock, yes
Helekanalaith Are you just saying that because I professed my adoration for Sunjammer, Annihilator-X17 :$
Annihilator-X17 more because of other things you said earlier :p
Helekanalaith Shht ;)
GLWizard Well, it's been interesting, but it's time for me to take off. See you all around- somewhere...
Annihilator-X17 Something that I didn't mention during the chat, but will here, is that right now, there is no room at all for additional specialization classes.
Annihilator-X17 You can't add any and have them selectable without overwriting an existing one.
Annihilator-X17 However, thankfully, Bio is already working on something to sort that out. That, at least, is the impression we've had
Lore What's a specialization class. I'm a n00b, I know
TigerDragon kind of like a prestige class in nwn i believe
BioCraig @Onyx To paraphrase Georg: Hit/miss calculation in dragon age is a simple % roll. The game determines your chance to hit based on several factors and then rolls a % check to see if an attack is successful.
BioCraig The core game design was for a ‘hit heavy’ system, meaning that we want the system to have a bias towards hitting rather than missing (a more satisfying game experience).
Helekanalaith So what you're saying is that (until they fix that) we either use the PRC's content or the original content?
Onyx ok.. but what stat affects to hit - dexterity or strength?
Annihilator-X17 The abilities refresh fast enough that you're usually able to keep a good stream of them going as well, at least as a spellcaster
Annihilator-X17 Pretty much Helekanalaith
Lore That means a commoner can succesfuly hit a dragon? ;)
Annihilator-X17 Well, possibly
Rane Who couldn't hit a dragon?
Rane Those things are huge.
Annihilator-X17 but there's also physical resistance
Rane Damaging it should be a whole different matter.
Helekanalaith In that case, might I suggest a class per class installer or some such? (If it doesn't get fixed in time)
Annihilator-X17 and that says whether your hit did anything to it
Annihilator-X17 Not possible Hel, as usual
Helekanalaith Replace installer with activatation tool then.
Annihilator-X17 Couple times while I was playing around in the game, I got "spell resisted" or "hit resisted"
Helekanalaith Activation*
Annihilator-X17 Hel, it's like NWN, its a 2da :P
Annihilator-X17 Plus, I'm not worried about it taking that long to get fixed :P
Onyx if my defense is 50 as is the attackers attack rating - will the cance to hit be 50% or higher?
Helekanalaith ~Annihilator-X17 Hel, it's like NWN, its a 2da :P << Problem being? 2DA swapper? ;p
Lore Are you PRC guys creating class concepts from scratch, or basing them in D&D. If yes, to what degree?
BioCraig But the 2das in DA are additive, unless you want to overwrite information all additional lines can be put into different packages and different 2das
fluffyamoeba no dnd
Annihilator-X17 We're doing all custom work, you can actually see a few designs on our forums already
* Lore is reliefed
fluffyamoeba as WotC may have ateeny objection to putting dnd content in a non-dnd game
Annihilator-X17 Plus, it's boring
Annihilator-X17 I've already done 175 of those, that's enough :P
fluffyamoeba also it's a different system
Helekanalaith Arcane Archer becomes Fade Bowman
Helekanalaith Sounds like a bad singer...
BioCraig so as long as you reserve value ranges in the 2da for each class, there shouldn't be anything to prevent you from packaging them separately (though I could easily be missing something as that isn't my specialty by any means)
Onyx fluffy, the rulsets are not copyrighted, it's only the lore, names etc
fluffyamoeba not true for computer games
Lore Atari holds comp game rights, as I reccall?
Onyx someone asked wotc about that, they said it's like i said
Helekanalaith I think the PRC's main concern is having to split up the scripts on a class by class level, Craig. Correct me if I'm wrong, though.
fluffyamoeba the rulesets are open for PnP (or at least some are) under the OGL, but this specifically excludes computer games
Helekanalaith Hence why I suggested a 2DA swapper or something ;p
Annihilator-X17 Given everything would hijack ability_core, we'd have the same issue we have in NWN, where we could distribute classes seperately, but the bulldozing of everything still happens.
Onyx basically nobody could forbid you to have 6 sec round, their stat system etc
Helekanalaith And true, fluffy. I remember that Planewalker.com wasn't even allowed to make their own Planescape game (or something like that) from WotC
BioCraig splitting scripts would indeed be trickier - I'm still hopefull that some usefull tricks can be made there though
Annihilator-X17 I suppose if we had a custom class_core that called ability core
Annihilator-X17 That might work.
fluffyamoeba well bioware don't split the scripts :)
fluffyamoeba as you have most abilities running form one script
fluffyamoeba er from
Annihilator-X17 well, there's what, 4? ability scripts
Onyx could you elaborate on the hitheavy system craig? if we have two chars with equal defense and attack rating.. what would be the to hit chance, do you know?
BioCraig pure speculationall abilities can actually be given their own scripts already
BioCraig strike the pure speculation from that, actually
Annihilator-X17 In other words, the NWN1 system?
fluffyamoeba nwn1 system smells
fluffyamoeba all that redundant scripting...
BioCraig each ability is assigned a script through the ABI_base.xls
BioCraig most route to the same set of scripts, but you can have your additional abilities route to whichever script you want
Annihilator-X17 prc_core, here we come :P
Annihilator-X17 stepping out for a sec
Lore Will there be a need for content installers, or are events handled ala NWN2=
BioCraig Packaging is still being tweaked, but I believe the intent is to have everything in a single file
BioCraig I'm not sure if that answers your question
Lore Neither do I actually
Helekanalaith Can large packages be split for distribution to smallband users?
Lore What i mean is, are there hooks on the single file to allow for community implementation of custom scripts without official files editing?
BioCraig any large file can be split with programs like WinRar, but I believe that Scott is looking at doing something within the packaging system to cover that (I'm really not sure, though)
Sunjammer Lore: yes that's essentially the whole event system
Sunjammer you can override the events you want to capture for an given object
Sunjammer and let the rest fall through to core or another script
Sunjammer you can even let the ones you captured fall through too
Helekanalaith Well programs like WinRar can handle that, yes. But your average user will then need a laundry list worth of instructions before it's usable for them.
Sunjammer if you want to simply add some functionality rather than replace it
Sunjammer and no editing of core scripts required
Sunjammer Helekanalaith Well programs like WinRar can handle that, yes. But your average user will then need a laundry list worth of instructions before it's usable for them. <<< that would be your average small band one ... since the broadband ones won't need that
Lore So basically it works like the NWN2 k_mod_*** that call script ccs_*** without you needing to overwrite the k_mod_***?
BioCraig Again, the intent is to make it completely seamless for the players - I just don't have the details of what that means.
Sunjammer mmm ... more like this
Sunjammer the default area script is area_core
Sunjammer it handles every area event
* Andarian nods
Sunjammer you come along and you want to change the pre_load or post_load event to do some fancy set up
Sunjammer you create area_lore (hee hee)
Helekanalaith Smallband users aren't my only fear, Sunjammer, it's also uploading large (single) files that might get cut off somewhere during the process. I might be using broadband, but I don't have an unlimited capacity of bandwidth. :/
Sunjammer in that you catch and process those event types and send any others on down to area_core
Lore That's even better:)
Sunjammer also
Sunjammer if the core script does something you want ... and you only want to do something extra before that
fluffyamoeba download manager, Helekanalaith
Sunjammer then you can catch the event, process it and then send it on to core
Helekanalaith Upload manager? :)
fluffyamoeba lol
Lore Gotta go, it was a very informative chat.
fluffyamoeba i don't think non-art files will be that big
Helekanalaith Pistolized: The age old question: boxes or barrels. Which type of item container do you prefer? Which fits better with the mood of Dragon Age? << I can't believe someone made a topic about this...
fluffyamoeba depends what they're using to compress stuff in the installer
BioCraig indeed - anyone who's got better than a 2400 baud modem isn't going to have a problem uploading or downloading our designer data
Andarian You can kind of do the same thing in NWN, by specifying your own event script that conditionally executes a base game script with pre- or post- processing...
fluffyamoeba and the addin system means that, if the mod builder chooses to do it that way, you only need to download art assets once
Helekanalaith Unless someone recompiles it under another name.
* Helekanalaith dreads seeing that
Andarian In DA, though, the scripts aren't event specific as they were in NWN1. The way I look at it it's more what NWN1 would have been like if it did everything with the tag-based system.
fluffyamoeba :p like the prc
Sunjammer yes ... tag-based item scripts are a reasonable approximation to the way DA works ... certainly close enough to help people get the concept
fluffyamoeba so, if mod builders use the addin system, there'll be no need for those mod-specific 2da haks
fluffyamoeba :)
Sunjammer tag-based scripts without the reliance on tags!
Andarian Right! :)
Helekanalaith Pity she isn't around to read it anymore.
Andarian Scripts seem to be more associated with a resource than with an event, now (hence the need for an event handler)
Helekanalaith Are you allowed to share what events we can rely on this time around?
Annihilator-X17 I doubt they're protected material, but there's a ton of them
Andarian I think so, but cataloguing all of that is one of the things the need documentation work
Andarian *needs
Annihilator-X17 Yerp. It might be on the wiki actually
Sunjammer there's like a gazillian
Sunjammer yes ... Bryan had them in one big list ... now each has a page
Sunjammer overkill i think
Annihilator-X17 Well, there are some that need a few extra comments
Annihilator-X17 like OnItemAcquire :P
Annihilator-X17 As we found out the hard way
Sunjammer but the last 2 or 3 hundred edits are just him moving them around
* Sunjammer scowls
Annihilator-X17 Yeah, that was annoying.
Sunjammer one thing I think would be useful
Sunjammer is a clear set of variable 2das without all the OC stuff
Sunjammer i.e. without Alistar_love_threshold
Helekanalaith Eh...
Sunjammer or Alistair_whining_like_a_little_girl_level
Annihilator-X17 lol
Annihilator-X17 think of all the things you could do with the variables in other mods though ;p
BioCraig It's ok - I got to look at your code for that module. There were at least a half dozen other things you did that would have prevented it from working.
Helekanalaith Please don't tell me OC specific stuff is (once again) integrated in basic scripts? :D
Annihilator-X17 Gee, thanks Craig :P
Sunjammer Yeah ... I feel a *whole* lot better now!
BioCraig Heh
Andarian lol
BioCraig They were all basic mistakes with using the plot flags - I don't think we've really explained that well enough yet
Sunjammer Sunjammer, TD wannabe, stumpped by a little old aquire item event
Sunjammer sure looks good on the old CV
Sunjammer Ah ... so it's your fault! Excellent
BioCraig yeah - that event really needs a comment to the effect that you need to set a variable on the item for the event to fire through to the module script.
Sunjammer don't worry there'll be one in the wiki ... of that you can be sure
Annihilator-X17 Yeah, I was expecting it to act like the NWN1 version of that event
Annihilator-X17 which fired regardless
Sunjammer What was up with the plot flags? I'm pretty sure I was just using one of the wrappers to check and set them
BioCraig It always fires for player_core, but it isn't routed to the module script unless the variable is set
Sunjammer unless the issue was between mains and defined
BioCraig you can't set defined flags, yeah
Sunjammer say what?
Sunjammer didn't we do that in the demo?
BioCraig defined flags are for conditions, they are only checked
Sunjammer so basicall their a bunch of constants set to 1?
Sunjammer *basically they're
Annihilator-X17 SJ, I think that was the one where we ran a little script and had the script set the plot value
Sunjammer see you've upset fluffy now
BioCraig main flags can be set or cleared or checked, but the associated script only fires if you set the bCallScript parameter to TRUE
BioCraig defined flags are FALSE by default - the value is defined by the script
Annihilator-X17 And once again, I'm glad I can dodge this :P
* Sunjammer is confused now
Annihilator-X17 Head spinning round?
BioCraig I'll see if I can get something up on the wiki this week - a better example with some details
Annihilator-X17 I think that would prove helpful
Annihilator-X17 hrmm, time to get some dinner.
BioCraig in the meantime I may post something on the beta forums
Sunjammer so the defined flag is simply a constant with a value of 256+ ?
Andarian I'm going to get going. Bye all!
Sunjammer some event sets a local with that value
Sunjammer and then you can check the local to see if it has that value in your plot script
Sunjammer ?
Annihilator-X17 cya Andarian
Annihilator-X17 I think thats right SJ, but i cant rememer all that ewell
Sunjammer can defined flags have values less than 256?
Sunjammer no they can't
Helekanalaith I'm off... Thanks for hosting the chat! ;p See you err... in a few hours after I've had some sleep.
BioCraig defined flags are meant to be evaluated each time they are called - so they check whatever conditions you want
Annihilator-X17 I'll give you SJ's address when you get back
Helekanalaith Thx :)
BioCraig that could be a local variable or it could be checking the player's current gender
BioCraig (not that the gender is likely to change)
Osagasu Someone will do it.
Sunjammer but if you can't change their value what is the point in evaluating them when they are called?
Osagasu Too many people like OOTS for it to not get done.
* Sunjammer has the feeling he is missing something really obvious
Annihilator-X17 value is changed by a script attached to the plot var
Annihilator-X17 i think
Annihilator-X17 maybe
BioCraig the point is having a centralized place to call on a script evaluated boolean, useable in conversations or in scripts
BioCraig and yes, the script determines the value each time the defined plot flag is called
BioCraig what I meant by default value was that if no script is attached to the plot, or the script does not handle that particular defined flag, calling on the value of the flag will always result in a FALSE
BioCraig I suspect I'm still not being clear - if only because I haven't provided the right context
Annihilator-X17 I think we just need more experience with it
BioCraig you can think of defined flags as being equivalent to conditional scripts for conversations in NWN
Sunjammer k
Annihilator-X17 Wouldn't actually know those, never used them for conversations.
Sunjammer ah wait
Sunjammer so basically a defined flag
Sunjammer is simply to tell you which
Sunjammer "plot event" called the associated plot script
BioCraig correct
Annihilator-X17 You know, not sure the logs are going to get posted tonight. I'm already ready to sleep ;p
Mia awwww
Annihilator-X17 However, I think that was the longest chat I've ever hosted.
Annihilator-X17 can't even think of questions for craig ;p
Annihilator-X17 oh, I do have one.
Annihilator-X17 Is it possible to create something aside from Mana or Stamina?
Annihilator-X17 If I wanted to try and create a third "power source"
Annihilator-X17 just name and visual
Annihilator-X17 not changing the mechanics any
BioCraig I'm not sure if they can be added to rather than replaced - it's quite possible either way, but I've never looked into it
Annihilator-X17 I'm sure I can create a local var and track it.
Annihilator-X17 but just thinking of new magic systems and the like.
Annihilator-X17 I've already got an idea for one system where you only get "mana" by killing foes.
BioCraig well you can define a creature property and set it easily enough, but I'm not sure if you could modify the GUI the way you might want
BioCraig possibly, but I really don't know
Annihilator-X17 yeah, i know i asked before about having mana & stamina both for the same class, for a sort of mage/fighter crossbreed
Annihilator-X17 the GUI is mildly annoying, mostly because we cant show the extra specialization options
Annihilator-X17 but i think thats being taken care of already
Annihilator-X17 i know fluff and i had a chat with one of the GUI coders.
Annihilator-X17 There's also trying to get base classes into the original campaign.
Annihilator-X17 I'm sure we'll have fun with that one
Annihilator-X17 and welcome back Flaming_Sword
Flaming_Sword hiya
Sunjammer pfft these Defined Flags are easy
Annihilator-X17 oh really? :P
Sunjammer just so long as you think of them as Schroedinger's cat
Annihilator-X17 Alive, Dead, or Bloody Furious?
Sunjammer Alive, Dead, Skinned in one of several ways
Annihilator-X17 skinned kitten? you cruel creature
* Mia walks away from the chan
Annihilator-X17 cya
Mia Night all
BioCraig Night
Sunjammer yeah ... 1am here
Sunjammer I should probably follow suit
BioCraig I should go too
BioCraig take care, all
Annihilator-X17 alright, take care all, and thanks for stopping by :)
Sunjammer thanks for the explanation Craig
Sunjammer see you around
BioCraig no problem
* BioCraig has quit IRC (Quit)
Tenjac yep
Onyx1 ah, i was interested if you could remove the armor from the zombies and skeletons (as they're always shown wearing it)..
Tenjac nope
Tenjac it's part of their appearance
Adinos Well, I just wanted to say thanks for hosting this.....it was useful, even though not all questions got answered.... we know more about some things than before, at least.
Osagasu D:
Onyx1 oh, so you can't modify them even a little?
Tenjac well, the chat log is going to have more answers than the chat
TigerDragon right
Osagasu I see how it is
Osagasu They want you to go to that site
TigerDragon some of the questions couldn't be answered and some were answered, but we ran short on time
Osagasu 10 till closing, I need to shut down
Osagasu See yall
TigerDragon so they didn't get repasted
Tenjac Haha... no, we just got so many questions and so many answers we can't cover them all
fluffyamoeba and Annihilator-X17 had a power cut in the middle
fluffyamoeba and as he was running the chat...
Annihilator-X17 yeah, that was annoying
Annihilator-X17 damn thunderstorms
BioCraig How'd it all turn out?
Tenjac if we tried to cover it all we would all still be here at 8:00
Onyx1 at least with the nwn2 toolset you can tint and scale monsters, in the da toolset you can't change monster appearance at all it seems, besides giving them weapons.
Tenjac went great Craig... thanks for all the help
Tenjac we didn't cover all the questions, but we're going to put all your responses in the logs
Annihilator-X17 we only just finished craig
Annihilator-X17 2 minutes before you arrived
Helekanalaith Sunjammer <3 ;)
BioCraig There are tints and variations available for some of the creatures
LdyShayna So the logs will lie about what participants actually saw? ;)
Onyx1 and for skeletons and zombies?
Tenjac right.. I just remembered working on the zombies and looking at putting new armor on them
fluffyamoeba there's not actually any zombies
Six Hopefully with the CC stuff, we'll be able to do a lot more than tint and scale with a little Max or paint-program-of-choice work :)
Adinos Any chance of a repeat session like this, .... say, in September?
fluffyamoeba we...repurposed something else
BioCraig It's just not possible to do the full tinting that NWN2 had without modifying art assets - which we aren't talking about yet.
Onyx1 well 2walking corpses" , same thing fluffy
fluffyamoeba :D they moved a bit quickly for zombies
Annihilator-X17 Adinos, we'll have another one at some point
Tenjac hahah yes
Tenjac that was something we wanted to look at but ran out of time
Tenjac I actually made 3 different types of zombies, as well as a basic weapon of every type
Onyx1 so all the zombie models come with a bucket on their head and those leather streps around their torso? :)
Annihilator-X17 lol
Tenjac turned out i should have been working on other things
Helekanalaith Lack of art asset talk puts a damper on predeveloping new content. :(
Annihilator-X17 yeah, well, that was a directive when we left Edmonton to not talk abut custom artwork
fluffyamoeba though tbh, we haven't really been told anything about the art stuff
Annihilator-X17 yeah, not much info there anyway
fluffyamoeba as for both events, the art people who got invited couldnt make it
Helekanalaith Probably making nudie stuff.
Adinos Well, we can plan.... of course, in my case, new content (models and textures in particular) are kind-of what I am most interested in, so I don't expect many answers for me for now
fluffyamoeba given the rating, that's probably in there somewhere already
Helekanalaith Jigglymesh?
Annihilator-X17 lol
Onyx1 do you believe they'll implement multiplayer and the possibility to make pw in a year or two?
fluffyamoeba no
fluffyamoeba as it's rewriting the engine :p
Onyx1 and that would take a lot of time?
Helekanalaith Still no multiplayer? Even after all those disgruntled posts? :O
fluffyamoeba well the original engine took 5 years...
Annihilator-X17 yeah, Dragon Age will likely be SP only, until a new game at least
fluffyamoeba yeah, 5 people on the interwebs want MP...
Annihilator-X17 lol
Six MP expansion pack?
Onyx1 5 years ago they still said it'll be a multiplayer game
fluffyamoeba and they hadnt written the engine then :p
Onyx1 "5 people".. yeah sure
LdyShayna Very unlikely an expansion pack would add it. Possibly a sequel or another game in the franchise.
LdyShayna If it is added
Onyx1 and that could come in a year or 2..
Adinos optimist!
Onyx1 i think that would be a smart move anyway..
Tenjac|AFK :P
Onyx1 wghile people are still very interested in the game
Tenjac|AFK and I think another event similar to this could certainly be possible :P
TigerDragon i'm one of those 5 people
TigerDragon >.>
Onyx1 me too.. i'm not very interested in custom modules but i somehow like pws from time to time.. rarely but still
Adinos if the social site re-opens before the game launch (as someone was saying), it might be a good idea to have another session at that time...once people have gotten a look at the wiki and such...
Six If the SP OC is playable, that I guess would balance the lack of MP a little
Six No comment on what I thought of the NWN OC :D
Onyx1 i think 5 people liked that
fluffyamoeba lol
Helekanalaith Maybe if we make more topics asking after multiplayer they'll quickly slap it together? ;p
Six Getting a game and toolset for the price of a game is a great deal MP or no MP?
Onyx1 fluffy, coul you say somrthimg about the customisation of placeables? so.. i heard you can change the material?
Six just as long as its not a crappy game
Onyx1 (mybe there'll be some custom conent genious that will implement mp?)
fluffyamoeba there's no point in asking me about art stuff, i really haven't touched it at all
* fluffyamoeba has no artistic talent at all
Onyx1 :)
Helekanalaith Singleplayer > Multiplayer. I have no time to deal with social drama online. (Not anymore at least :( )
Onyx1 so.. what is your talent then?
fluffyamoeba breaking things
fluffyamoeba er...scripting
Onyx1 the thing i'm least interested in :(
Andarian From what I saw, I don't think that an MP version is anywhere in the offing
XavierGrimwand Does anyone know if OpenOffice is sufficient for editing DAO's 2DA files?
BioCraig it is
Six [23:01] Helekanalaith Singleplayer > Multiplayer. I have no time to deal with social drama online. (Not anymore at least :( ) << Social or "Social, wink wink"
Andarian And I'm quite happy personally with it as an SP game -- that's all I mod or play
fluffyamoeba "social" site indeed
Lore Or to that matter Notepad?
Onyx1 but.. isn't it a bit weird that bioware decided to build an engine that perevents multiplayer?
fluffyamoeba notepad no as they are excel files
fluffyamoeba not really as only 10% of people who bought nwn ever played it mp
Helekanalaith Uhhh... the latter (@ Six)? ;)
Andarian Onyx: I don't think so, no. Why would it be?
Onyx1 i don't know about the exact percentage.. but thats still A LOT of players
fluffyamoeba and you have to compromise on some things to get mp
Six Whats all this with you and Strat then, Hel? :D
Onyx1 because many people are interested in the multiplayer aspect of games.. isn't it logical
Helekanalaith Dunno, he's playing hard to get... Didn't like something I filled him in on earlier. :p
Andarian I think it's a matter of identifying your target audience and trying to make the best possible game you can for that audience...
Onyx1 and the compromise argument.. i really don't bite into it
fluffyamoeba o really
fluffyamoeba so... DA loads 1 area into memory at once
fluffyamoeba nwn had to load all of them for mp
fluffyamoeba you only have a certain amount of memory you can use
fluffyamoeba so areas have to be smaller/less detailed/fewer instead
Adinos eh, doesn't it load one "area list" into memory ?
Andarian ...and they focused on those things that enhance and enable story-based single-player gaming (cutscenes, cinematics, and so on)
Helekanalaith Semantics, Adinos :)
fluffyamoeba yes, but i think the general idea is that there's a limit on that
fluffyamoeba so i mean - not the whole module
Adinos right
Andarian Trying to be "all things to all people" dilutes your focus, and can impose an architecture on you that doesn't do any specific thing very well, but several things moderately well
Adinos on the subject of size.....how big is the toolset (how many MB, that is) ?
fluffyamoeba hmm...not sure actually
Onyx disconndcted :/
fluffyamoeba as it presumably shares assets with the game itself and we dont have that
* Flaming_Sword hopes fluffyamoeba is still logging >_>
Helekanalaith For those in the know, how is its resource consumption compared to let's say... Visual Studio?
Andarian Gotta run -- later folks!
Helekanalaith Laters.
fluffyamoeba that depends - the toolset loads things as you need them
fluffyamoeba so if you never load an area, it uses far less memory than if you have 10 areas open and 20 creatures
Adinos are you allowed to talk about assets, like, how many different placeables there are and such? I am wondering how that compares to NWN (and NWN2)
Helekanalaith Hm. Makes sense. The creatures still have 3D previews then?
fluffyamoeba hel, yup
fluffyamoeba assets, i have no idea because we've not got all of them afaik
Lore Is there serious risk of crashes, if the user opens to many windows, or does the toolset recognize that and limit the number of open windows?
* Six would love if there was some way of texture swapping, either in toolset, dynamically, or even just via 2da
Six Like how cloaks work in NWN1
BioCraig @Adinos: There are a large number of placeable appearances - I don't have the toolset handy so I can't say an exact number
fluffyamoeba we've been getting more as more things have been shown in screenshots, but i dunno what proportion we have
Six Guess that's not really something that'll get answered
BioCraig but much higher than nwn1 at launch
Adinos OK, thanks...
Helekanalaith Even in regards to normal objects and creatures?
Helekanalaith Like say... wild life?
fluffyamoeba crashes: yes it crashes, but not that often. and because of the versioning system it's not really an issue
fluffyamoeba as in it's "oh i need to restart the toolset (and email a bug report)" not "aaaaargh it's corrupted 3 months' work"
Helekanalaith Aw, we don't get to learn from our mistakes then ;)
Lore A builder worth it's name would have backups at the very least, no ;)
BioCraig additional note on placeable appearances: though there are probably at as many as a couple hundred of these, they are a small subset of the number of props you can use in cutscenes and the level editor
Adinos those resources are really where my main interest is - I really look forward to being able to manipulate them in various ways in 3DS Max (or, in the case of textures) in Photoshop.
fluffyamoeba scott meadows, who does the toolset, challenged us to crash the toolset in such a way that it corrupted data... and i don't think we managed it yet
Lore I've got faith on you, you'll succeed. It's but a matter of time ;)
BioCraig Generally there are very few crashes with the toolset - I tend to run it with between 10 and 40 assets open at a time without troubles.
BioCraig Assets ranges everywhere between areas and levels down to creatures and scripts
Helekanalaith Any potential danger to using another's SQL statements?
fluffyamoeba well, yes :p
fluffyamoeba if someone writes an sql statement to delete the database...
fluffyamoeba ...then it'll delete the database :p
Helekanalaith No warnings on mass adjustments or the likes?
fluffyamoeba if you're editing the database directly, you are using mssql tools, not the toolset
* Helekanalaith wonders if the toolset will crash if all the data suddenly goes missing ;p
Helekanalaith Ah, there's no way to pass statements through scripts then?
fluffyamoeba while it's running - probably. will probably also crash if you delete its exe while it's running too
fluffyamoeba Helekanalaith, no - the database is a builder resource
fluffyamoeba actual modules (things with running scripts) are exported from the database and packaged
* Helekanalaith nods.
Lore I know nothing of SQL so do not kill me, but is there any risk of the community distributing virus, or even just mod corrupter toolset editing programs using SQL stuff?
fluffyamoeba not as such
Adinos but you could implement a virus-like disease in a mod.... ;-)
* Annihilator-X17 wanders back in
fluffyamoeba Adinos, not really because the mod is not distributed as an sql dump
fluffyamoeba :p
Flaming_Sword little bobby tables ;)
Helekanalaith Couldn't help but read "little booby tables"
Onyx do you know the base cooldowns for daggers /swords/ two handed swords perhaps?
Adinos no, I mean...something that would work just within one playable module.... infect all creatures you encounter
Annihilator-X17 Onyx, combat is still on a 9 second round, rom what i remmeber, so there isnt individual weapon cooldown
Onyx combat seems a bit too fast for my taste.. maybe because i'm used to d&d rpg games with slow swinging at the beginning
Annihilator-X17 at least, not that i remmeber
Annihilator-X17 not looked too deeply into that, though
Onyx hm, i thought every weapon hits in intervals.. dagger for example every 1.5 sec (with modifiers) swords every 2 sec. etc
Lore One last question, how much of the combat system is scripted, and how much hardcoded?
BioCraig @Onyx I don't know the exact cooldowns on the various weapon types, but they are all changeable in 2das
fluffyamoeba however, the animations woul dlook odd if you change the speed too much
BioCraig I'm not sure what this 9 second round stuff you are talking about it
Annihilator-X17 that was mentioned to us at the builder's event
Onyx i know they'rew changeblae i just wanted to know what can i expecr in the official campaign
Annihilator-X17 wb sunny
Sunjammer howdy
Helekanalaith Sunjammer <3
fluffyamoeba you have a fan!
Annihilator-X17 bit more than a fan ;p
Adinos Anyhow, this was interesting....but it's getting late here in Europe, and I have to be at work early tomorrow, so bye, everyone
Helekanalaith 0:)
fluffyamoeba byee
Sunjammer Tenjac might get jealous
Onyx bye bye
Helekanalaith I doubt Tenjac will hold the inside of your pocket as religiously as I would.
Sunjammer so how did things finish up after I left for food (which I've only just got and it's not chilli it's pasta)
BioCraig @Lore Almost all of the combat is script controlled - very very little is hardcoded.
Rane So turn-based combat is more than possible?
Annihilator-X17 problem in that instance is probably the gui, which is hardcoded.
Onyx if you script a turn i guess :)
Onyx ohh, yeah, that' a thing i hate.. no combat log :(
Lore That is nice, I'm sure the PRC team will not have to go through the process of creating a basically new combat system this time round ;)
fluffeeeamoeba well scriptwise, yup you could
Annihilator-X17 No, we're planning on just using the existing one, rather than recreating it ;p
BioCraig You can prompt pauses through script at the end of a round if you wanted to go to the trouble of scripting it.
Rane That's not really turns though.
Annihilator-X17 I haven't looked, is there a timestop effect?
Helekanalaith "Pause"
fluffyamoeba there's pausing
Annihilator-X17 yeah, but i mean one that pauses everything but the one its called on
fluffyamoeba as there's definitely references in script to the autopause config
Helekanalaith Can we prevent warrior and rogue players from using pause? :p
Onyx can you talk a bit more what affects attack speed, to hit chance?
Annihilator-X17 lol
BioCraig @Rane: it effectively could be by disabling your abilities when it wasn't your "turn" and pausing when it was- but that would require a fair amount of effort
Sunjammer BioWare: so guys we made you this rilly cool, pause and play, real time action crpg
Sunjammer Community: cool
Sunjammer Community: but can we change the setting to Eberron, change it to turn based and drop all the story elements?
Annihilator-X17 you forgot: And add multiplayer
Helekanalaith + Aribeth
Sunjammer with mounts and climbing
Lore and a DM client
Rane Change it?
Annihilator-X17 and DnD rules :P
Helekanalaith Climbing and mounting Aribeth? Sounds kinky.
Rane Hardly.
Lore and flying mounts
Rane Just creating something in addition to the campaign itself.
Onyx hm.. i don't get the point in ridiculing the wish to mod with the toolset to its limits..
Helekanalaith Let's not make it a D&D game... for you know what reasons. ;)
Sunjammer still at least like with NWN2 all those total makeovers will be out in 15 weeks (tm)
Onyx yes, we can go by the staple, but why should we?
Annihilator-X17 gahaha
Annihilator-X17 I remember those SJ :)
Sunjammer so we should be safe until 2012ish
Rane From Soon™ to 15 Weeks™?
Rane Cool
Lore Point is, no matter how moddable it is, people will want more. Next I'm sure we'll have, can I create an FPS?
Helekanalaith That'd be cool too. :o
Annihilator-X17 Hel, you like everything :)
Helekanalaith Just need crosshairs... darn, no GUI additions :(
Flaming_Sword "can i create nethack?" :P
Rane Visual effect?
Lore no GUI was a bit of a shock, yes
Helekanalaith Are you just saying that because I professed my adoration for Sunjammer, Annihilator-X17 :$
Annihilator-X17 more because of other things you said earlier :p
Helekanalaith Shht ;)
GLWizard Well, it's been interesting, but it's time for me to take off. See you all around- somewhere...
Annihilator-X17 Something that I didn't mention during the chat, but will here, is that right now, there is no room at all for additional specialization classes.
Annihilator-X17 You can't add any and have them selectable without overwriting an existing one.
Annihilator-X17 However, thankfully, Bio is already working on something to sort that out. That, at least, is the impression we've had
Lore What's a specialization class. I'm a n00b, I know
TigerDragon kind of like a prestige class in nwn i believe
BioCraig @Onyx To paraphrase Georg: Hit/miss calculation in dragon age is a simple % roll. The game determines your chance to hit based on several factors and then rolls a % check to see if an attack is successful.
BioCraig The core game design was for a ‘hit heavy’ system, meaning that we want the system to have a bias towards hitting rather than missing (a more satisfying game experience).
Helekanalaith So what you're saying is that (until they fix that) we either use the PRC's content or the original content?
Onyx ok.. but what stat affects to hit - dexterity or strength?
Annihilator-X17 The abilities refresh fast enough that you're usually able to keep a good stream of them going as well, at least as a spellcaster
Annihilator-X17 Pretty much Helekanalaith
Lore That means a commoner can succesfuly hit a dragon? ;)
Annihilator-X17 Well, possibly
Rane Who couldn't hit a dragon?
Rane Those things are huge.
Annihilator-X17 but there's also physical resistance
Rane Damaging it should be a whole different matter.
Helekanalaith In that case, might I suggest a class per class installer or some such? (If it doesn't get fixed in time)
Annihilator-X17 and that says whether your hit did anything to it
Annihilator-X17 Not possible Hel, as usual
Helekanalaith Replace installer with activatation tool then.
Annihilator-X17 Couple times while I was playing around in the game, I got "spell resisted" or "hit resisted"
Helekanalaith Activation*
Annihilator-X17 Hel, it's like NWN, its a 2da :P
Annihilator-X17 Plus, I'm not worried about it taking that long to get fixed :P
Onyx if my defense is 50 as is the attackers attack rating - will the cance to hit be 50% or higher?
Helekanalaith ~Annihilator-X17 Hel, it's like NWN, its a 2da :P << Problem being? 2DA swapper? ;p
Lore Are you PRC guys creating class concepts from scratch, or basing them in D&D. If yes, to what degree?
BioCraig But the 2das in DA are additive, unless you want to overwrite information all additional lines can be put into different packages and different 2das
fluffyamoeba no dnd
Annihilator-X17 We're doing all custom work, you can actually see a few designs on our forums already
* Lore is reliefed
fluffyamoeba as WotC may have ateeny objection to putting dnd content in a non-dnd game
Annihilator-X17 Plus, it's boring
Annihilator-X17 I've already done 175 of those, that's enough :P
fluffyamoeba also it's a different system
Helekanalaith Arcane Archer becomes Fade Bowman
Helekanalaith Sounds like a bad singer...
BioCraig so as long as you reserve value ranges in the 2da for each class, there shouldn't be anything to prevent you from packaging them separately (though I could easily be missing something as that isn't my specialty by any means)
Onyx fluffy, the rulsets are not copyrighted, it's only the lore, names etc
fluffyamoeba not true for computer games
Lore Atari holds comp game rights, as I reccall?
Onyx someone asked wotc about that, they said it's like i said
Helekanalaith I think the PRC's main concern is having to split up the scripts on a class by class level, Craig. Correct me if I'm wrong, though.
fluffyamoeba the rulesets are open for PnP (or at least some are) under the OGL, but this specifically excludes computer games
Helekanalaith Hence why I suggested a 2DA swapper or something ;p
Annihilator-X17 Given everything would hijack ability_core, we'd have the same issue we have in NWN, where we could distribute classes seperately, but the bulldozing of everything still happens.
Onyx basically nobody could forbid you to have 6 sec round, their stat system etc
Helekanalaith And true, fluffy. I remember that Planewalker.com wasn't even allowed to make their own Planescape game (or something like that) from WotC
BioCraig splitting scripts would indeed be trickier - I'm still hopefull that some usefull tricks can be made there though
Annihilator-X17 I suppose if we had a custom class_core that called ability core
Annihilator-X17 That might work.
fluffyamoeba well bioware don't split the scripts :)
fluffyamoeba as you have most abilities running form one script
fluffyamoeba er from
Annihilator-X17 well, there's what, 4? ability scripts
Onyx could you elaborate on the hitheavy system craig? if we have two chars with equal defense and attack rating.. what would be the to hit chance, do you know?
BioCraig pure speculationall abilities can actually be given their own scripts already
BioCraig strike the pure speculation from that, actually
Annihilator-X17 In other words, the NWN1 system?
fluffyamoeba nwn1 system smells
fluffyamoeba all that redundant scripting...
BioCraig each ability is assigned a script through the ABI_base.xls
BioCraig most route to the same set of scripts, but you can have your additional abilities route to whichever script you want
Annihilator-X17 prc_core, here we come :P
Annihilator-X17 stepping out for a sec
Lore Will there be a need for content installers, or are events handled ala NWN2=
BioCraig Packaging is still being tweaked, but I believe the intent is to have everything in a single file
BioCraig I'm not sure if that answers your question
Lore Neither do I actually
Helekanalaith Can large packages be split for distribution to smallband users?
Lore What i mean is, are there hooks on the single file to allow for community implementation of custom scripts without official files editing?
BioCraig any large file can be split with programs like WinRar, but I believe that Scott is looking at doing something within the packaging system to cover that (I'm really not sure, though)
Sunjammer Lore: yes that's essentially the whole event system
Sunjammer you can override the events you want to capture for an given object
Sunjammer and let the rest fall through to core or another script
Sunjammer you can even let the ones you captured fall through too
Helekanalaith Well programs like WinRar can handle that, yes. But your average user will then need a laundry list worth of instructions before it's usable for them.
Sunjammer if you want to simply add some functionality rather than replace it
Sunjammer and no editing of core scripts required
Sunjammer Helekanalaith Well programs like WinRar can handle that, yes. But your average user will then need a laundry list worth of instructions before it's usable for them. <<< that would be your average small band one ... since the broadband ones won't need that
Lore So basically it works like the NWN2 k_mod_*** that call script ccs_*** without you needing to overwrite the k_mod_***?
BioCraig Again, the intent is to make it completely seamless for the players - I just don't have the details of what that means.
Sunjammer mmm ... more like this
Sunjammer the default area script is area_core
Sunjammer it handles every area event
* Andarian nods
Sunjammer you come along and you want to change the pre_load or post_load event to do some fancy set up
Sunjammer you create area_lore (hee hee)
Helekanalaith Smallband users aren't my only fear, Sunjammer, it's also uploading large (single) files that might get cut off somewhere during the process. I might be using broadband, but I don't have an unlimited capacity of bandwidth. :/
Sunjammer in that you catch and process those event types and send any others on down to area_core
Lore That's even better:)
Sunjammer also
Sunjammer if the core script does something you want ... and you only want to do something extra before that
fluffyamoeba download manager, Helekanalaith
Sunjammer then you can catch the event, process it and then send it on to core
Helekanalaith Upload manager? :)
fluffyamoeba lol
Lore Gotta go, it was a very informative chat.
fluffyamoeba i don't think non-art files will be that big
Helekanalaith Pistolized: The age old question: boxes or barrels. Which type of item container do you prefer? Which fits better with the mood of Dragon Age? << I can't believe someone made a topic about this...
fluffyamoeba depends what they're using to compress stuff in the installer
BioCraig indeed - anyone who's got better than a 2400 baud modem isn't going to have a problem uploading or downloading our designer data
Andarian You can kind of do the same thing in NWN, by specifying your own event script that conditionally executes a base game script with pre- or post- processing...
fluffyamoeba and the addin system means that, if the mod builder chooses to do it that way, you only need to download art assets once
Helekanalaith Unless someone recompiles it under another name.
* Helekanalaith dreads seeing that
Andarian In DA, though, the scripts aren't event specific as they were in NWN1. The way I look at it it's more what NWN1 would have been like if it did everything with the tag-based system.
fluffyamoeba :p like the prc
Sunjammer yes ... tag-based item scripts are a reasonable approximation to the way DA works ... certainly close enough to help people get the concept
fluffyamoeba so, if mod builders use the addin system, there'll be no need for those mod-specific 2da haks
fluffyamoeba :)
Sunjammer tag-based scripts without the reliance on tags!
Andarian Right! :)
Helekanalaith Pity she isn't around to read it anymore.
Andarian Scripts seem to be more associated with a resource than with an event, now (hence the need for an event handler)
Helekanalaith Are you allowed to share what events we can rely on this time around?
Annihilator-X17 I doubt they're protected material, but there's a ton of them
Andarian I think so, but cataloguing all of that is one of the things the need documentation work
Andarian *needs
Annihilator-X17 Yerp. It might be on the wiki actually
Sunjammer there's like a gazillian
Sunjammer yes ... Bryan had them in one big list ... now each has a page
Sunjammer overkill i think
Annihilator-X17 Well, there are some that need a few extra comments
Annihilator-X17 like OnItemAcquire :P
Annihilator-X17 As we found out the hard way
Sunjammer but the last 2 or 3 hundred edits are just him moving them around
* Sunjammer scowls
Annihilator-X17 Yeah, that was annoying.
Sunjammer one thing I think would be useful
Sunjammer is a clear set of variable 2das without all the OC stuff
Sunjammer i.e. without Alistar_love_threshold
Helekanalaith Eh...
Sunjammer or Alistair_whining_like_a_little_girl_level
Annihilator-X17 lol
Annihilator-X17 think of all the things you could do with the variables in other mods though ;p
BioCraig It's ok - I got to look at your code for that module. There were at least a half dozen other things you did that would have prevented it from working.
Helekanalaith Please don't tell me OC specific stuff is (once again) integrated in basic scripts? :D
Annihilator-X17 Gee, thanks Craig :P
Sunjammer Yeah ... I feel a *whole* lot better now!
BioCraig Heh
Andarian lol
BioCraig They were all basic mistakes with using the plot flags - I don't think we've really explained that well enough yet
Sunjammer Sunjammer, TD wannabe, stumpped by a little old aquire item event
Sunjammer sure looks good on the old CV
Sunjammer Ah ... so it's your fault! Excellent
BioCraig yeah - that event really needs a comment to the effect that you need to set a variable on the item for the event to fire through to the module script.
Sunjammer don't worry there'll be one in the wiki ... of that you can be sure
Annihilator-X17 Yeah, I was expecting it to act like the NWN1 version of that event
Annihilator-X17 which fired regardless
Sunjammer What was up with the plot flags? I'm pretty sure I was just using one of the wrappers to check and set them
BioCraig It always fires for player_core, but it isn't routed to the module script unless the variable is set
Sunjammer unless the issue was between mains and defined
BioCraig you can't set defined flags, yeah
Sunjammer say what?
Sunjammer didn't we do that in the demo?
BioCraig defined flags are for conditions, they are only checked
Sunjammer so basicall their a bunch of constants set to 1?
Sunjammer *basically they're
Annihilator-X17 SJ, I think that was the one where we ran a little script and had the script set the plot value
Sunjammer see you've upset fluffy now
BioCraig main flags can be set or cleared or checked, but the associated script only fires if you set the bCallScript parameter to TRUE
BioCraig defined flags are FALSE by default - the value is defined by the script
Annihilator-X17 And once again, I'm glad I can dodge this :P
* Sunjammer is confused now
Annihilator-X17 Head spinning round?
BioCraig I'll see if I can get something up on the wiki this week - a better example with some details
Annihilator-X17 I think that would prove helpful
Annihilator-X17 hrmm, time to get some dinner.
BioCraig in the meantime I may post something on the beta forums
Sunjammer so the defined flag is simply a constant with a value of 256+ ?
Andarian I'm going to get going. Bye all!
Sunjammer some event sets a local with that value
Sunjammer and then you can check the local to see if it has that value in your plot script
Sunjammer ?
Annihilator-X17 cya Andarian
Annihilator-X17 I think thats right SJ, but i cant rememer all that ewell
Sunjammer can defined flags have values less than 256?
Sunjammer no they can't
Helekanalaith I'm off... Thanks for hosting the chat! ;p See you err... in a few hours after I've had some sleep.
BioCraig defined flags are meant to be evaluated each time they are called - so they check whatever conditions you want
Annihilator-X17 I'll give you SJ's address when you get back
Helekanalaith Thx :)
BioCraig that could be a local variable or it could be checking the player's current gender
BioCraig (not that the gender is likely to change)
Osagasu Someone will do it.
Sunjammer but if you can't change their value what is the point in evaluating them when they are called?
Osagasu Too many people like OOTS for it to not get done.
* Sunjammer has the feeling he is missing something really obvious
Annihilator-X17 value is changed by a script attached to the plot var
Annihilator-X17 i think
Annihilator-X17 maybe
BioCraig the point is having a centralized place to call on a script evaluated boolean, useable in conversations or in scripts
BioCraig and yes, the script determines the value each time the defined plot flag is called
BioCraig what I meant by default value was that if no script is attached to the plot, or the script does not handle that particular defined flag, calling on the value of the flag will always result in a FALSE
BioCraig I suspect I'm still not being clear - if only because I haven't provided the right context
Annihilator-X17 I think we just need more experience with it
BioCraig you can think of defined flags as being equivalent to conditional scripts for conversations in NWN
Sunjammer k
Annihilator-X17 Wouldn't actually know those, never used them for conversations.
Sunjammer ah wait
Sunjammer so basically a defined flag
Sunjammer is simply to tell you which
Sunjammer "plot event" called the associated plot script
BioCraig correct
Annihilator-X17 You know, not sure the logs are going to get posted tonight. I'm already ready to sleep ;p
Mia awwww
Annihilator-X17 However, I think that was the longest chat I've ever hosted.
Annihilator-X17 can't even think of questions for craig ;p
Annihilator-X17 oh, I do have one.
Annihilator-X17 Is it possible to create something aside from Mana or Stamina?
Annihilator-X17 If I wanted to try and create a third "power source"
Annihilator-X17 just name and visual
Annihilator-X17 not changing the mechanics any
BioCraig I'm not sure if they can be added to rather than replaced - it's quite possible either way, but I've never looked into it
Annihilator-X17 I'm sure I can create a local var and track it.
Annihilator-X17 but just thinking of new magic systems and the like.
Annihilator-X17 I've already got an idea for one system where you only get "mana" by killing foes.
BioCraig well you can define a creature property and set it easily enough, but I'm not sure if you could modify the GUI the way you might want
BioCraig possibly, but I really don't know
Annihilator-X17 yeah, i know i asked before about having mana & stamina both for the same class, for a sort of mage/fighter crossbreed
Annihilator-X17 the GUI is mildly annoying, mostly because we cant show the extra specialization options
Annihilator-X17 but i think thats being taken care of already
Annihilator-X17 i know fluff and i had a chat with one of the GUI coders.
Annihilator-X17 There's also trying to get base classes into the original campaign.
Annihilator-X17 I'm sure we'll have fun with that one
Annihilator-X17 and welcome back Flaming_Sword
Flaming_Sword hiya
Sunjammer pfft these Defined Flags are easy
Annihilator-X17 oh really? :P
Sunjammer just so long as you think of them as Schroedinger's cat
Annihilator-X17 Alive, Dead, or Bloody Furious?
Sunjammer Alive, Dead, Skinned in one of several ways
Annihilator-X17 skinned kitten? you cruel creature
* Mia walks away from the chan
Annihilator-X17 cya
Mia Night all
BioCraig Night
Sunjammer yeah ... 1am here
Sunjammer I should probably follow suit
BioCraig I should go too
BioCraig take care, all
Annihilator-X17 alright, take care all, and thanks for stopping by :)
Sunjammer thanks for the explanation Craig
Sunjammer see you around
BioCraig no problem
* BioCraig has quit IRC (Quit)
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